Protecting the waiters and barkeepers from what? If they just had normal minimum wage rules, and service was included in the price, they would not need “protection” from a self-inflicted problem.
How is adding a required 20% gratuity to a bill at a restaurant not false advertising? The restaurant advertises the food costs X dollars, then you get your bill and it’s now 20% higher?
Because technically they advertise the price of the food, not the price of gratitude.
But they only want to buy the food, not the gratitude.
From the perspective of the rest of the world, the US is really weird about prices.
America once again showing the world what a dystopian shit show it is. People are travelling to what they think is a developed country and so rightly assume all workers are paid a decent wage. Certainly European visitors would assume that. Highlights once again the need for a minimum wage and union support for workers.
Why would they assume that? America is famously a shitty country for workers. You’d have to know nothing about the country you’re visiting to not know that
Why do North Americans tip when they go to Europe?
Because they were too stupid to check the local customs before the trip. And it shows, not only with the tipping, but with a lot of problems they cause.
Because we’re an uneducated shithole, obviously 😝
restaurants are fighting back
Unless it’s by raising their prices by 15-20% and paying their employees a living wage, it ain’t gonna work. Tipping is moronic.
They’ll raise their prices and give the employees nothing, just wait and see.
That’s essentially what they’re doing, but with a surcharge rather than just raising their menu because we love adding on tax and fees here in the US
It’s a bad deal that only policy could really fix at this point.
If you’re the only store with real menu prices then customers just get price shocked at what they’re actually going to be paying when they can go next door to another restaurant that doesn’t tell you the full price up front. Customers would be upset at a mid $18 burger, but at fine with a mid $16 burger + $2 tip.
Imo, the problems stem from the forced rat race of no one having enough money excluding the rich. Prices being high wouldn’t matter if people got paid more, but cause we’re not getting paid more, the companies that target the general population just make everything into cheap knockoff crap to still turn the same or better profit margins.
Lol
It’s not my fucking job to make sure your workers are paid appropriately. I came here for a fucking steak and some freedom fries. I paid for my fucking food and I just want to eat it in peace. Stop turning your problems into my problems.
But here’s the thing, it ain’t the owners’ problem either. They’re winning. The whole reason they do this is to externalize labor costs and do ad hoc market segmentation, except it’s based on customers kinda being dicks. When you don’t tip in the US, you have sided with the owners and have said to the server, “you are worth minimum wage.”
Agitate the rest of the day. Tip at mealtime.
Or, don’t eat places that don’t pay their workers
I mean, that’s a better choice than “fuck my waiter, specifically and today, while not affecting his bosses’ bottom line at all.”
Yep. Continuing to patronize that establishment, whether or not you tip, perpetuates tipping culture.
Yes. Those are your choices. Either
A) don’t eat places that don’t pay their workers
Or
B) Tip at the place you chose to go to that relies on tips.
It’s literally that simple.
Wrong
The owners are the bad actors here. They enjoy increased margins in an environment where additional salary top ups are somehow the customer’s problem.
Pay your waitstaff you cheap fucks
The owners are the bad actors but the only person getting screwed when you don’t tip is the server.
Don’t want to tip, don’t eat out. It’s pretty simple.
If the job didn’t come with the tip, they wouldn’t be able to hire. Not tipping is the actual solution.
Fuck those waiters I guess, right?
Either you think the situation is okay or you don’t and shouldn’t enable it through your behavior. Simple as. That being said, I usually tip (and well) from shear pressure. I think the whole vibe is gross though.
The situation sucks, but until there’s a mass movement to stop it, not tipping only hurts the people at the bottom.
If you don’t want to enable it the answer is to not eat out, not to screw over the waitstaff who are counting on it to make rent.
Boycotting the restaraunt is the actual solution.
Not tipping just makes you an asshole.
All restaurants in the US require tipping. You’ll have to boycott all of them, and that won’t send a message about tipping. You would need the majority of people to still go to restaurants and not tip to send the message and that’s never going to happen because people have been brainwashed to think their value as a human being requires generous tipping. Comments like “if you don’t tip you’re an asshole” means the system is working as intended and will never change.
Not true. There’s a restaraunt in my town (and not even a very large town!) that pays all staff the same (relatively decent) wage and splits any tips they do happen to get equally among all staff. Obviously people will still tip, because that’s the culture here, but if you didn’t tip it’s not like the staff won’t be paid at all.
Places like that are rare but they’re out there, and the principled thing to do would be to spend your money with establishments that are doing their best to be part of the solution.
I wish this exposed tipping culture for what it is, but America is so deep in capitalism that you’ll hear more complaints against this.
It’s so fucking stupid
Just raise the prices by 20% and also pay the staff 20% more.
But fuck workers’ rights and living wages, right?
They wouldn’t need to raise prices that much.
During the Obamacare debate the Papa John’s CEO was upset that he would have to raise pizza prices a few cents to pay for the health insurance his workers need. Wealthy people are psychopaths.
For some reason I thought I remembered seeing an article about Papa John dying. Apparently I was mistaken.
Bummer…
But then what do the owners get?
/s
Tipping is fucking stupid but it is the current system for how US waiters earn a living. So to fuck them over and not tip does nothing to change the system and only leaves them overworked with no money.
Think materially and tip your servers. Believe me they would like it to change too. It isn’t them that keeps the system in place. Big business has the money to lobby against our human and material needs.
Servers don’t want the system to change as they make more money with tips than they would from a “livable wage”
Former euro server here. Got a livable wage plus tips. Not the mandated kind, just the extras people would leave. That would net me 5 euros per hour above my livable wage.
Yeah definitely not arguing against earning a livable wage via being paid that livable wage by the employer. That should be the system. But sadly that isn’t the system and not paying a tip in the states isn’t going to do anything to change the system.
For example, the unhoused crisis is caused by the same ultra rich classes that keep tipping around. But I’m not going to pretend that the unhoused aren’t people with real immediate needs. I will give them money when I can. I will vote and push for change as well. Material concerns of the moment are more important to me than strict idealism.
Yeah I’m absolutely on board and quite in favor of what you argue. The institutionalized out sourcing of wages is absurd.
I can’t be against tipping as a concept, as I live in a place where it works, but the us system irks me.
But we can and should be more social. Helping oneself instead of borrowing the selfishness of the upper class.
Y’all living privileged idealogue navel-gazed lives can do what you want I guess. We here in the working class are tired, overworked, and are trying to survive the day.
You’re more frustrated at people that don’t leave tips over the fact you are seen as less than a person by the owners that pay a pitiful wage. Look to the people that came before you, look up Mario Savio.
The non-tippers are complicit, they patronize my job and give the owner their money, but don’t think I’m deserving of any either as evidenced by them not tipping. My boss doesn’t give a shit whether I’m tipped or not, and if I leave over it he’ll have my replacement within the hour and the system continues.
Sure, be an ideologue all you want and “tipping is wrong!” So don’t come into my store. That’s the only way to make my boss feel it instead of me, if you come in, give him $20 and give me the finger for wasting time on you, yes, of course I’m mad at both of you.
Yes. People can do what they want. Tips are optional, and are for good service…not to subsidize owners. If you can’t afford to work in a restaurant, find something else to do for a living.
Just go eat at McDonalds then.
I haven’t eaten at a McDonald’s since the 90s. I refuse to support that corporation.
I just think that it’s on owners to pay their staff a living wage, or for staff to realize they’re not going to be able to make a decent living and move on to something where they can. If an owner can’t make that work, the business wasn’t strong enough to survive anyways.
I lived in Australia for a few years and think their system is far better. The only way our system is going to change is for people to reject it.
This is generally false. Most waiters would see more consistent income with fewer instances of subjective nonsense like ideologues who don’t believe they have to follow the basic cultural rules of the place in which they visit. There is an exceptional subset of waiters that would make less for sure but they are in a minority.
I put livable wage in quotation marks because it wouldn’t actually be a livable wage. The pay would likely be 1-2x minimum wage which is still not livable in most places
People most definitely want to be paid by their employer rather than tips. This isn’t a bottom up movement keeping tipping in place. It is ultra rich people invested in the restaurant industry that keep it around. The same people that use the National Restaurant Association to effectively lobby against minimum wage hikes to meet that “livable wage” and pro-unionization regulation.
Not once you consider healthcare, taxes, and social security.
The presence of a livable wage doesn’t affect any of those though?
The employer still pays FICA on tipped revenue, and paying for insurance has nothing to do with their wage
Nope. It’s not my obligation to pay their wages directly. They can accept no tip, they can lobby for a living wage from their employer, or they can find a different job. I am okay with all of the above.
The only way change happens is through action, not just crying about it. If you want change, stop tipping.
ah yes, put the onus on the people just trying to survive while still patronizing the restaurant that the owner continues to make profits on.
If you feel this strongly, you should boycott all restaurants that make their servers rely on tips.
Yet still the only one hurt is the worker, the boss got theirs when you paid for your meal.
“The worker can leave if they don’t like serving me for free while worrying about homelessness” yeah, and you could cook at home or go to a restaurant that doesn’t use the tipping model (they exist), yet you chose to go somewhere that the worker relies on tips and enjoy in the exploitation with the owner, you are an essential part in keeping the business running the way it does. On top of that you exploit them further yourself by knowing full well how it works and who you’re really hurting and justifying it in your selfish mind so you can pinch pennies. Even if the worker does quit the owner just pulls the top application off the stack and gives them a call, there’s a revolving door of people willing to do whatever they have to to avoid becoming homeless. Most often that worker then just cycles to another restaurant an continues the cycle themselves as they can get another waitstaff job easier than anything else.
Not only are you literally changing nothing, you’re actively participating in the exploitation you claim to be against, you’re not the business owner, no, but without you his exploitation wouldn’t work.
Tbf, while the system exists as it does, not tipping the workers only hurts the workers you supposedly support, their employers don’t care because they got theirs already and there’s a revolving door of people who need work bad enough when the worker gets fed up.
If you actually wanted to help those workers you’d have to entirely not support businesses that use the tipping model by “not going there” and only go to ones that don’t. Or you could go, but while there try and unionize servers, I suppose. But then when the workers strike for the thing you want you’ll still have to not cross the picket line so it’s the same in the end just more effective.
I practice what I preach btw, I only go to restaurants that don’t run off tips for the most part, and I tip when I do happen end up at one of those places. Sometimes I’ll tip even at places that don’t really “run off tips” but I want to help out a bit, like my local taco truck, I love them so much and don’t mind throwing them an extra $2 to show my appreciation, they’re not rich people it’s just a family trying to get by, with great prices no less.
To summarize: I don’t pass out info on unionizing, but I do support non-tipping businesses on average and still don’t fuck the workers over in a misguided attempt to hurt their boss when I do end up at a tipping place.
This is it 100%.
I’m shocked at the amount of responses here willing to make the workers suffer so that they can continue getting their food/drinks and supporting the owners taking advantage of the system.
Reason #37 why I will never visit this shithole country.
Tip is a con
As far as tipping, Reynolds understands why some visitors aren’t leaving American-sized gratuities.
“They’ve already spent a lot of money to be here in the first place,” he said. “The tipping, I’m not too fussed about it.”
His advice? Embrace the local customs.
“I think if you do come here, you should just engage in the culture because I think you’ll have a better time.”
In what way tipping makes my stay better? American are so far up their ass they made tipping their culture. If you just include it into the price and then pay the waiter/waitress like human being then there won’t be any confusion.
Imagine Americans going to other countries and complaining that they don’t get free refills or free water and saying stuff like “if you’d just increase the cost of everything, you could afford to offer free refills and free water”
Like, I agree, tipping culture sucks and I wish it wasn’t the norm in America but IT IS and to just go there and pretend like they should change overnight for tourists is such a wild take.
Getting pissed at tourist because you lie and say something is not mandatory when it actually is such a fun hyperbole to read. Especially since they are not there to visit the country. They couldn’t care less about culture of the US. They are there to watch football (yah, not soccer) and it just so happens the world cup is there lmao. I hate football and I’m so glad I don’t feel the need to go to such a worker exploiting country…
The bosses who make their money regardless and exploit the worker say it isn’t mandatory, the workers who are actually the ones affected by lack of tips say it is mandatory, wanna guess why the discrepancy exists? Because the boss makes their money regardless and you only harm the poor worker by not tipping, that’s why. The workers couldn’t care less about your dumb fucking game, pay me or don’t come in, fuck my boss, and fuck your reasoning for being in the country, you are so act accordingly.
(The royal you, I read your comment lol)
And “soccer” was originally British slang for “association football,” gridiron football outpaced it in popularity and won the title “football” over association or rugby football. Big ol’ “who cares” on that one.
Of course the water is free. And in many places you can get a free refill of coffee (Sweden).
Tipping does not lead to better service. Arguably worse, They want you out asap to get the next tipper in the seat.
Also, can’t see why someone should pay a waiter more for bringing 5 steaks an 5 champagnes instead of 5 burgers and 5 soda’s. Kind of the same job and effort.
I remember when I spent time in the US, tipping was the absolute worst part of the experience.
If I was with a big group going to a restaurant we would have a server constantly checking in with us, chatting and telling stories, getting us deals and freebies. When I would go out alone I would get ignored. If I dressed down I would be treated worse than if I was dressed up. One time I even waited an hour for a table before walking out as larger groups got seated ahead of me. How people are treated is based on how much money they think you’ll hand over.
Everything about tipping is greed and it’s gross.
Tipping does not lead to better service.
Spoken like someone who’s never experienced a French waiter.
You people are so obsessed with attention and false happiness. The server doesn’t care about you they have to beg and grind to get to minimum wage. It’s one step above indentured servitude.
As a server: I literally do care though. I love my regulars and it makes my day when they come in.
I’d still care just as much if I got paid a living wage, but like, don’t say we don’t care when many of us absolutely do.
Lol, you don’t know shit about me.
I definitely think we should pay a living wage to everyone and I’m working to pass that in my city & county, but that’s doesn’t mean I’m in denial about the faux friendliness that results from tipping culture or that the staff are more attentive (it’s much less common for staff to ask if you want more drinks without you having to get their attention in countries without tips than those with)
In the US I hated how the waiters were always bothering me with fake smiles “everything ok sir? do you need something?” while I’ve got my mouth full of food and no interest in conversation. I’ll call if I need something, thank you.
I like living in a society of peers, I don’t need to feel “served”.
Oh I completely agree, I just think it’s ridiculous to pretend tipping doesn’t impact service.
What I was trying to convey is that it has an adverse effect on service in my opinion.
You’re showing your usian bias, of course its less likely that a server elsewhere in the world is going to interrupt your meal. That doesn’t mean they won’t be available when you need them. The rest of the world doesn’t expect or what someone interrupting their experience every 5 minutes, but we know we can signal them when we need something.
It sounds like you want to improve the working day for your own people, but you need to recognise that what you are aiming for is already well below the standard.
French waiters are honest, which I prefer.
Some of the best service I received was in Hong Kong, it was efficient and moderately rude
Maybe better is not the right term but tipping definitely results in politer and usually faster service, there is no point in pretending it doesn’t have an impact.
And I’m against tipping culture, I’m just not in denial that it has an impact.
Best service I received was in Japan without tipping
if I remember well, in Japan tipping is easily seen as an insult
It absolutely is an insult. They see it as “you don’t think i work for someone who pays me enough, but I do.”
Do you tip before you get your meal? If not then they are just working to get you through faster, because a standard 15% every 30 min is better than hoping for 20% for a longer customer.
There are plenty of ways to get faster table turn that don’t involve rushing your customers, like making sure the food is prepared quickly and accurately, or taking payment earlier so that customers can leave whenever they would like.
Obviously, yes, more tips makes more money than less-but-slightly higher tips, but a good server will manage to achieve both high quality and efficient service.
But yeah, everyone needs to make a livable wage, and tipping culture only helps the owning class.
I guess the tourist never really cares about the local custom or the local worker. It’s up to the locals to fix their labour laws.
That US tipping culture doesn’t make any sense. Tipping should be optional when customers think they got wonderful service. In other words, it is up to the customer to decide and not part of the “menu”, neither should it be an expected component of the employment package, it should be a bonus not given by the employer.
It makes lots of sense when you realize that it makes more money for the owning class, so they like it a lot.
Also it got started right after slavery ended, so you can imagine who was getting told “sorry you didn’t make any money today, better luck tomorrow.”
What really doesn’t make sense from a customer perspective is that recently everywhere you go somebody is asking for a tip, but you’re only expected to tip:
- Taxis but not busses or trains.
- Restaurants but not fast food restaurants, and sometimes restaurants add a service fee that may or may not include the expected tip, especially if you are with a large group. Typically, you are expected to tip if you are assigned a seat, somebody takes your order while you are seated and brings your food to you, and you pay after you eat.
- Food delivery but not any other kind of delivery.
Examples of inappropriate places where a tip is sometimes requested but not expected:
- When placing an online order from a warehouse.
- When placing an order at a fast food restaurant.
- When buying something that you picked up off a shelf yourself and carried to the checkout.
Maybe this is the event that can spark change. If people aren’t tipping, so servers quit their jobs to go work somewhere with better base pay, owners will be left taking the hit.
I’m sure they’ll find some way to make the workers suffer instead, but this could be what’s needed to get rid of corporate “tip culture”.
Unless you have a degree or work a skilled trade, it’s pretty hard to find a job that out-earns serving. Most places, good servers and bartenders are actually making enough to live on (after tips), which you’d only get in retail if you’re management. (Sometimes not even then!)
Former food service worker here:
You have to break into the unskilled office/warehouse sector, but to do that you almost have to know someone there already.
Or (if you’re lucky enough to be able to, most aren’t as they keep you purposefully locked in), restaurant your way through trade school and pick one up. Now you have a new set of problems (you’re locked into “helper” and nobody wants to teach you enough to compete with them, pretend you don’t want your license), but you’re paid better to have those problems, and imo they’re easier to work around than selfish prick customers that want to hurt your boss by giving him money but “help” you by telling you to fuck yourself.
Still hard, but “retail” ain’t it, those are your only options.
That isn’t how it works, the worker quits and the owner hires another person who needs a job bad enough they’re applying there. There’s a revolving door because it’s easy to get hired, there’s no drug tests or background checks or min experience (they say there is but it’s a lie, they’ll hire children), all the people applying need that job now because they need to pay rent (and most in the industry are addicted to something which helps them be exploitable), or they can’t get hired anywhere else because of a criminal record, etc.
Revolving door goes brrrr and the workers either cycle to a “better” restaurant in the same system or finally break free and learn a trade or something, but the system continues exploiting the next individual and always will as long as you are willing to support the exploitation by patronizing the establishments that work this way. The only way to end it is if you the customer stop giving the business itself your money instead patronizing restaurants that pay fair, the business doesn’t care if Susan gets tipped, they got their money for your steak, Susan is the only one who cares about wasting time serving you for free when she needs to make rent to avoid homelessness.
Trust me, I was so close to homeless working in a restaurant job, stuck in an abusive relationship because they paid their half of the rent and without that I couldn’t afford to live anywhere, they ended up leaving before I got out and I was down to the absolute wire but I got a better job and pulled it through, borrowed a few bucks from some friends but made it. The restaurant didn’t change because I left, they just got a new “me.” Probably been through 5 of them by now and there’s more lined up to take the 6th+ place.
