The entire Bible should clearly be disregarded over the whole bird thing. Unless of courses you are seriously telling me that the ancient hebrews didn’t use our western classification systems for animals, but that would just be ludicrous.
As for talking donkeys, you can’t bring obvious fiction or superstition into the real world by proclaiming “MIRACLE”. That’s now how reality works.
And “hey the slave didn’t die so by all means carry on owning another human being as property” is not the moral flex you think it is.
You haven’t proven the bible is accurate or moral. You’ve only proven that you are brainwashed by your religion into justifying atrocities and need to work on bettering yourself.
Finally, why are you explaining your holy book? A book that supposedly contains the infallible word of a god should not need mere mortals to explain it. God should have hired a holy ghost writer.
As for talking donkeys, you can’t bring obvious fiction or superstition into the real world by proclaiming “MIRACLE”. That’s now how reality works.
That’s literally what a miracle is. You’re using circular reasoning here. “Miracles that defy natural explanation did not happen because they defy natural explanation, and nothing can defy natural explanation because we have never seen it happen, therefore miracles cannot and did not happen”
You are typing the words yourself and not getting it. That is definitely some sort of talent.
If there is a claim that something supernatural happened, it better have rock solid evidence to support it. Calling something a miracle because you want it to be true does not make it true. Proving it does. And the only proof of any “miracle” in the bible is - guess what? - cited using the bible. That’s what circular reasoning is.
If you make a claim with no objective, testable, flasifiable proof, all you have is a claim. And until you provide robust proof, I will dismiss your claim.
And the only proof of any “miracle” in the bible is - guess what? - cited using the bible. That’s what circular reasoning is.
Actually, no. It’s not. If I was saying “This miracle happened which is why the Bible is true, the proof it happened is because the Bible says so and it did because it’s true” then yes, that would be circular reasoning.
To develop this further because I enjoy infodumping on my special interests, you can divide the Bible into two natures: theological and historical. You start with the historical It is worth mentioning that the Bible is a collection of human writings, which we have divided into 66. (Some were written as the same work but were divided up, like Luke and Acts or the Penteuch, but that’s another topic)
So, my thought process is simple. I believe that parts of the New Testament was written first-hand by people who knew Jesus of Nazareth. The pattern of the writings show whoever wrote it was historically familiar with their surroundings. It was generally undisputed who wrote these at the time. They line up enough to be giving a consistent narrative, but not enough to be copying each other in the case of John vs the Synoptics (The synoptics did borrow from each other quite a bit). This is the crux of the matter- Is the New Testament reliable? If you put it under scrutiny and come to the conclusion simply that it is written by people who knew Jesus of Nazareth and that they genuinely believed in what they were saying (considering they got absolutely destroyed by the romans for this belief and didn’t stand to benefit as well), then what follows is that Jesus literally rose from the dead, must have really been God and whatever He and the Holy Spirit taught is true. Then, what follows is that whatever Jesus taught is in fact true, so eg, we should love our neighbours. Then since He quoted the Old Testament and also appointed disciples and spoke of the Holy Spirit, it’s worth concluding that these writings are also true.
So if the Historical nature of the Bible is true, then Jesus’ divinity is true. If Jesus’ divinity is true, then the theological nature is true. But the Bible cannot be used to prove the Bible. When I was younger, my skeptical mind was disappointed by a tract proposing the question “Is the Bible True” ans concluding ‘yes’ because a bible verse says it is. Sure, St Paul who was witnessed receiving a vision of Jesus and being blinded can attest that He is writing with the Holy Spirit as He has the credentials, and Jesus can attest the Holy Spirit was in the Old Testament because He is God and thus has the credentials, but it cannot be used to ascertain whether or not the Bible is historically true.
If you make a claim with no objective, testable, flasifiable proof, all you have is a claim. And until you provide robust proof, I will dismiss your claim
With this standard, good luck trying to prove that most of history happened.
Another issue with this standard- Miracles are miraculous because they aren’t really testable - if holding a flame up to a stick of dry wood causes it to catch fire, that’s not a miracle, that’s just considered science. Your standard is deliberately designed in such a way so that you’d never believe a miracle.
13 And these ye shall have in detestation among the fowls; they shall not be eaten, they are a detestable thing: the great vulture, and the bearded vulture, and the ospray;
Direct Hebrew translation.
It wasnt listing birds nor fowls
it was telling you that you shall not eat fowls NOR those things
There are a bunch of modern documented miracles, the Lord works in mysterious ways
As I said, most of that does not apply to us anymore as Christ fulfilled it
In order: Leviticus 11:19
2 Peter 2:16 & Numbers 22:28
Exodus 21:20-21
Leviticus 11:19 the stork, any kind of heron, the hoopoe, and the bat.
2 Peter 2:16 but he was rebuked for his own disobedience. A speechless donkey spoke with a man’s voice and stopped the madness of the prophet.
This is a miracle, not a statement that donkeys speak (literally SPEECHLESS DONKEY)
Numbers 22:28 The LORD opened the mouth of the donkey, and she said to Balaam, “What have I done to you, that you have struck me these three times?”
Again, A MIRACLE
Exodus 20:20 Moses said to the people, “Don’t be afraid, for God has come to test you, and that his fear may be before you, that you won’t sin.”
The entire Bible should clearly be disregarded over the whole bird thing. Unless of courses you are seriously telling me that the ancient hebrews didn’t use our western classification systems for animals, but that would just be ludicrous.
OOPS
Exodus 21:20 “If a man strikes his servant or his maid with a rod, and he dies under his hand, the man shall surely be punished.
Exodus 21:21 Notwithstanding, if his servant gets up after a day or two, he shall not be punished, for the servant is his property.
if the servant is “beat to death”, the man will be punished
and as Jesus fulfilled the Old Testament, it mostly doesnt apply to us anymore
Bats don’t belong on that list.
As for talking donkeys, you can’t bring obvious fiction or superstition into the real world by proclaiming “MIRACLE”. That’s now how reality works.
And “hey the slave didn’t die so by all means carry on owning another human being as property” is not the moral flex you think it is.
You haven’t proven the bible is accurate or moral. You’ve only proven that you are brainwashed by your religion into justifying atrocities and need to work on bettering yourself.
Finally, why are you explaining your holy book? A book that supposedly contains the infallible word of a god should not need mere mortals to explain it. God should have hired a holy ghost writer.
That’s literally what a miracle is. You’re using circular reasoning here. “Miracles that defy natural explanation did not happen because they defy natural explanation, and nothing can defy natural explanation because we have never seen it happen, therefore miracles cannot and did not happen”
You are typing the words yourself and not getting it. That is definitely some sort of talent.
If there is a claim that something supernatural happened, it better have rock solid evidence to support it. Calling something a miracle because you want it to be true does not make it true. Proving it does. And the only proof of any “miracle” in the bible is - guess what? - cited using the bible. That’s what circular reasoning is.
If you make a claim with no objective, testable, flasifiable proof, all you have is a claim. And until you provide robust proof, I will dismiss your claim.
Actually, no. It’s not. If I was saying “This miracle happened which is why the Bible is true, the proof it happened is because the Bible says so and it did because it’s true” then yes, that would be circular reasoning.
To develop this further because I enjoy infodumping on my special interests, you can divide the Bible into two natures: theological and historical. You start with the historical It is worth mentioning that the Bible is a collection of human writings, which we have divided into 66. (Some were written as the same work but were divided up, like Luke and Acts or the Penteuch, but that’s another topic)
So, my thought process is simple. I believe that parts of the New Testament was written first-hand by people who knew Jesus of Nazareth. The pattern of the writings show whoever wrote it was historically familiar with their surroundings. It was generally undisputed who wrote these at the time. They line up enough to be giving a consistent narrative, but not enough to be copying each other in the case of John vs the Synoptics (The synoptics did borrow from each other quite a bit). This is the crux of the matter- Is the New Testament reliable? If you put it under scrutiny and come to the conclusion simply that it is written by people who knew Jesus of Nazareth and that they genuinely believed in what they were saying (considering they got absolutely destroyed by the romans for this belief and didn’t stand to benefit as well), then what follows is that Jesus literally rose from the dead, must have really been God and whatever He and the Holy Spirit taught is true. Then, what follows is that whatever Jesus taught is in fact true, so eg, we should love our neighbours. Then since He quoted the Old Testament and also appointed disciples and spoke of the Holy Spirit, it’s worth concluding that these writings are also true.
So if the Historical nature of the Bible is true, then Jesus’ divinity is true. If Jesus’ divinity is true, then the theological nature is true. But the Bible cannot be used to prove the Bible. When I was younger, my skeptical mind was disappointed by a tract proposing the question “Is the Bible True” ans concluding ‘yes’ because a bible verse says it is. Sure, St Paul who was witnessed receiving a vision of Jesus and being blinded can attest that He is writing with the Holy Spirit as He has the credentials, and Jesus can attest the Holy Spirit was in the Old Testament because He is God and thus has the credentials, but it cannot be used to ascertain whether or not the Bible is historically true.
With this standard, good luck trying to prove that most of history happened.
Another issue with this standard- Miracles are miraculous because they aren’t really testable - if holding a flame up to a stick of dry wood causes it to catch fire, that’s not a miracle, that’s just considered science. Your standard is deliberately designed in such a way so that you’d never believe a miracle.
Direct Hebrew translation.
It wasnt listing birds nor fowls it was telling you that you shall not eat fowls NOR those things
There are a bunch of modern documented miracles, the Lord works in mysterious ways
As I said, most of that does not apply to us anymore as Christ fulfilled it
Define “accurate” or “moral”
Infallible ≠ Simple
Bonus 6. I’m tired of you.
Is that not the church’s whole thing? You’d think they would be better at it.
Matt 5:17
Matthew 5:17 Do not think that I have come to loosen the law or the prophets. I have not come to loosen, but to fulfill.
He has not come to loosen the laws but to fulfill them
This statement is told because the Pharisees were claiming that he was teaching people to ignore the law of Moses
By fulfill, he means completely live a sinless life that no Israelite had managed, becoming the first and last to do so.
This is also why the sacrificial system was abolished too, because Jesus’ sacrifice was enough to the Lord for eternity.
You haven’t provided proof, only claims. It doesn’t make me uncomfortable, juat disappointed that some people are so credulous.
Shroud of Turin 500+ Witness accounts letters from ROMAN OFFICIALS to Caesar
I could but I don’t care enough.