Context
The Trump administration classified the Italian hacktivist group Autistici / Inventati as a terrorist organisation[1], meaning that American companies could no longer do business with them.
The immediate outcome was the closure of their Paypal account used for donations, and the loss of one of their .org domains, which is managed by the Public Interest Registry, an American non-profit company.
Before that, that administration retaliated against International Criminal Court Judge Nicolas Guillou and former EU commissioner Thierry Breton as well as four of his collaborators by sanctioning them, which essentially cut them off American services likes bank processors and parcel delivery, among other things.
My questions
Given that most Europeans are not activists nor political figures, how likely do you think it is to happen to individuals? Do you believe that Trump could use sanctions and embargos against the entire EU or some of its countries as leverage? The rational part of me thinks no, but we have seen so much crazy shit since his mandate started that my anxious side leans yes.
Personally, I have been trying to reduce my reliance on US tech and companies for the past two years, because really, the US cannot longer be trusted. And maybe I am overreacting, but I’ve got myself a .eu domain to replace the .com I use for self-hosting.
Every single person should be worried when the right occupies power. They WILL come for you eventually
Yes, fascists will go for more and more targets until they control everything.
Just look at the German fascism 1933 to 1945: First they targeted jews, then they were after more and more minorities and at some point everyone was in danger. They never stop, fascism is basically a paperclip maximiser.
First they targeted jews,
Funny thing about that. The famous poem actually starts “first they came for the communists”, because that’s what happened historically.
Okay, but maybe that doesn’t count because they came for the communists before 1933, when Germany was still a liberal democracy. Besides, communism and socialism and trade unions are all political choices, they’re not minority identities. They don’t count.
Well, in that case it would be “first they came for the queers”. They didn’t even get a line in the poem for some reason, but they should have. The Nazis treated queer people worse sooner than Jews. Destruction of gathering sites, book burnings, murders, mass imprisonment, attempted genocide, whatever category of mistreatment you consider it by, queers were hit before Jews. And this all started rolling out in 1933, just after the Nazis gained power.
The idea that the Nazis came for the Jews first is a very deliberate liberal-imperialist lie, an attempt to erase every part of Nazi oppression that western imperialists also enjoy partaking in.
Because that’s the unfortunate truth. There is no line separating our societies from fascist ones. No moment you read the news and go “oh my god they’re doing something they’ve never done before”. Because they are already treating so many people horribly and we do not speak out. From the slaves that make our products to the migrants escaping regions our militaries keep unstable.
Either you wait until it’s too late and the fascists come for you, or you fight against liberal imperialism. Those are your only options.
I think you took my “first” as a literal “the very first group”, I’m just trying to say they start going after some groups and then more and more groups of people.
Thank you for this comment! I guess we will only have sufficient backlash, when they come for all the ones that are quiet now. But by then we will already have lost the queer, the jews, the refugees ind so many others.
This. Fascists wer funded by the capital and quite a chunk of the liberal and “christian democracy” scene were find and dandy with then rounding up communists.
Of cruelty
It’s a self eating snake
Mark Carney nods
An environmental activist group in Belgium has been placed on a terrorist watchlist, as well as its most prominent members. So (a) it is happening, (b) Trump does not need to, the EU is perfectly capable of doing this on its own.
Which group is that? I tried googling but nothing came out on my end ( could be USA search results algorithm?)
Code Rood (code red)
This is the not the Belgium CR but the one from Netherland.
So they disbanded because people got sick of ambulances being blocked on the streets and you think that’s similar to what Trump did? 🤣🤣🤣
they and prominent members are on terrorist watch lists. I’m not saying it’s as bad as in Trumpland.
Meh if you don’t get on a list what are you even doing with your life at this point?
people got sick of ambulances being blocked on the streets
I’ve heard this used as baseless right-wing propaganda against Extinction Rebellion Netherlands, which does always coordinate with emergency services.
So do you have a source on Code Rood actually failing to do that? Or are you just spouting right-wing lies?
Continuing to ditch US products is the best way to minimise any potential fallout. But A/I also had their European bank accounts locked, some companies will comply as a precaution to avoid getting dragged into a bigger mess.
I use an N26 account as intermediary for donations to political groups or the graphene foundation. My actual bank is an ethical one that mainly invests in sustainable things and gives me an option for an atm card that is not on thr visa or mastercard network.
They didn’t want to get locked out of SWIFT which is controlled by the US. They would have been a crippling if not killing blow if that had happened.
Makes sense, thanks. Still, overly excessive and I would like to see this played out in courts fast. I do hope there are ways for Europe to fight this nonsense, but I won’t expect much from Italy’s government.
I don’t know, do you think people living in Lille, Brimingham or Krakow should have been worried in 1933?
People in the Netherlands were like: “Probably fine, it’s over there.”
Then they invaded, found records of what religion people following and started going after the Jewish population.
The best data is that which does not exist and cannot fall into the wrong hands.
No. They were absolutely not. My Oma(Grandmother) was Dutch and lived through the occupation.
As I was told growing up:
They knew Jewish people were being attacked, but also, as it got closer to WW2, that they were increasingly being arrested and just vanishing. Local Jewish families started to flee Europe entirely, everyone knew that war was likely and that Netherlands would be invaded.
One such family had a lawyer who was friends with my great-grandfather, but he also had a sick, elderly mother who couldnt make the trip to the US. My great grandfather sheltered them before the war started. They were turned in during the war by a neighbor. The lawyer and his mother died in the camps, the Nazis let my Great Grandfather out in a prisoner release(and tried to get the lawyer and Dutch jews out) that was the exchamge for using a local factory(which gave them intentionally faulty parts).
My Oma’s family then joined the resistance.
Yep, in these times we have to grow into heroes as Hannie Schaft.
trumps a nutter and nothing is off the table. you might as well ask what the joker might try to do. a really old, fat, pathetic joker.
It’s like saying, ‘should I be worried because they are arresting tuba players?’
Trump is insane and will do what he wants, with no idea or the consequences
The problem with trade embargos and sanctions is that if you use them excessively, you’re just sanctioning yourself.
That’s a relief, totally makes the problem go away /s.
I mean, it very literally does. The US built the postwar global economic system. And we built it in a way that was quite friendly to our interests.
The US for instance controls the global system of payment transfers. And we can cut people and countries off from that system if it serves our interests. But this is a power you can only use very sparingly, ideally only in situations with broad international consensus. A friendly government isn’t going to lose sleep and start building their own payment systems after they see us sanction Al Qaeda. But if we start sanctioning their private citizens for peaceful activities that just happen to go against the politics of the man in the White House? Suddenly every friendly government has to worry they may be next. If allies as steadfast as Canada or Denmark can end up a US target, then no one is safe. That’s the kind of environment where governments start building their own alternative international payment networks. And the payment system is just one tool the US built in the post war period.
Despite the US military, the US relies far more on soft power than hard power. Ultimately we’re less than five percent of the global population, and we’re a literal ocean away from most human beings. We don’t have the ability to impose our will on the world by force. Trump is learning this the hard way. We’ve only been able to maintain the influence we’ve had through soft power, mutually beneficial trade relationships, and through reasonably balanced military alliances.
Trump is destroying all of that. Countries around the world were willing to accept US hegemony because the alternative would be risky, expensive, and on the whole just not worth the trouble. But when we abuse the tools that we have, then other nations have great incentive to find alternatives to the American options. And the more countries that do that? The weaker the US becomes.
Soft power is just that, soft. At it’s most influential, it’s an aura you build around yourself to encourage the world to willingly follow you. If you try to beat someone over the head with soft power, the club made of soft power simply breaks in the attempt.
It’s not that it goes away. It’s more like throwing a live grenade at your enemy while you’re both stuck in the same room. He is so obsessed with hitting his “enemy” that he doesn’t realise he himself is in the line of fire.
What exactly has that to do with “Buy European”?
This community is for discussing European products/services and news related to that.
Do you believe that Trump could use sanctions and embargos against the entire EU or some of its countries as leverage?
You mean the tariffs?
